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Page 25
Feb 16 2015
New update with ND Sap. I highly recommend to read it over. I don't have it mastered yet, but have been having full success and there are others that wonder why.
I had a conversation with someone on another forum, Skepler at RIU. Take this into consideration before reading the ND Sap walk through. I don't want to see anybody wasting their material.
This person had some old QWISO that was like a thick tar that should have naturally decarbed, but it did not fully decarb. He pretty much confirmed it and we discuss possibly why in this conversation. My oil is more liquid, like honey, because all three batches I made, grain alcohol was involved and I deliberately left some alcohol. Even though the first batch was QWISO, it was winterized with grain alcohol. Here is a link to the thread if you are interested in the entire conversation. http://www.rollitup.org/t/stepped-on-hash.860162/page-2#post-11321146The conversation with Skepler begins on page 2.
To answer your question, when it comes to naturally decarbed oil, I am pretty much a beginner. I would have more experience under my belt, but it has been quite a rough winter so far. I have not been able to do any testing.
Yes, I did at least 3 separate natural decarbing oils. Yes, all three oils were somewhat liquidy. You have provided the most feedback on a natural decarbed oil. Someone else had some old BHO lying around, I am not sure if it was putty, or shatter though, they did not say. I do know that they don't typically decarb it as they are more into smoking it. In other words, it did not fully decarb for you, they were not able to provide me that information, all they could say is that they got a buzz. I have a feeling their BHO was not fully decarbed, I come to that conclusion after speaking with you.
Obviously there is more to the natural decarbing than what I initially thought. At first I thought like you, that it was the thickness. After I saw dried buds naturally decarb, I just assumed most hash oils would naturally decarb. I guess I would have to agree with you that the viscosity probably is why yours did not fully decarb over that period of time. If it were my oil and my product, for example, my first batch of QWISO that naturally decarbed for me, that is when I learned of it, I made a large batch and was not able to consume it all within 100 days vaping it. If I would have tried to decarb my QWISO after it had naturally decarbed, it would have ruined it. Obviously there is something going on here. There is something else to consider. My QWISO was winterized with grain alcohol. The other two batches I made were made QWET, all grain alcohol. Extremely big difference between the two. The winterizing made it more potent and a super clean high that I had never felt before, but the non winterized oil made with grain alcohol gave me a buzz I never had for the first 24 hours, it was like my mind felt more in control. Then it gave me an additional 24 hours, which no other oil had given me, which felt more like the RSO. I wanted it to be all organic. I doubt it, but maybe the grain alcohol has something to do with it. That still leaves to question why the buds decarbed. Then again, the buds are not dense like a thick tar. It does make sense it being more liquid aiding in releasing the gas. When I open up a vial for the first time that has decarbed, it reacts like a shaken soda can, foams right over the top. This happened three times before it was fully decarbed. My QWISO that was winterized with the grain alcohol, I deliberately left a little alcohol in it so it would mix better with the PG USP for the vaporizer. This was so I could mix without using heat. If I didn't like it, I knew I could just allow the QWISO to dry more and the alcohol would be gone.
I like your term gassing, first time I heard that. I never would have respected that term until I started using vials for the ND Sap. Every time I crack open a vial it would release some pressure all the way until it is fully decarbed, then it no longer builds up pressure. At first I thought it had to do with the small amount of alcohol left in it and the temperature swings in the house causing the pressurization. Later I realized it was due to the decarbing. I believe it to be primarily CO2 and decarbing. After it was fully decarbed, it never released pressure again. Even when I had to add alcohol to it because it got thick and the dropper would no longer suck it up.
Another thing that can be considered, all three times I made the ND Sap, the oil became pressurized due to the gassing and being sealed. With the QWISO, first time around, it blew the ends of the syringes off after it started to decarb. I lost quite a bit of oil on that one!
Now that I think about it, there are a lot of times I have had old premium buds in jars that I never got around to using. Hadn't opened them in a while. When I crack the jar open it would release pressure. I thought that was just due to temperature swings. Now I attribute that to the decarbing. That is something the oil and the buds that have naturally decarbed have in common besides the 3 to 4 month wait. They have all pressurized. I don't think that has anything to do with it, but it could.
The next batch I do, hopefully sooner than later, I have everything I need except for the spare time, I am going leave more alcohol and will try burping it weekly and document when the pressure begins to build up and if it decarbs sooner. My stuff was like a thick oil, honey. This next time I will keep it more liquid and shake it daily. See if it will decarb sooner.
I believe you are right it has to do with the thickness. I am going to find out for sure. Also, if I just wanted to use isopropyl, assuming that you are right, don't want to winterize and lose medicinal properties, don't want to add grain alcohol without winterizing because it can chunk up and separate, I would just store it liquid with iso, store it for the 100-120 days, after it decarbs, then allow it to finish the purging, or air drying.
You say low heat extraction process. Tell me more about that. I am not familiar with that process you used to make your product.
Did you use 99% iso?
How did you store the tar like QWISO? Syringe, vial, jar? Basically, was it sealed air tight?
Your tar like QWISO, is it sticky or is it more like putty, not sticky but mushy?
I am just curious.
Thanks, you have given me something to think about!
Two more questions. What is your opinion on why dry buds will decarb over a 4 to 6 month period but your oil did not?
What quality of material did you use to make that large quantity of hash that you had for such a long time? Premium buds, shake, leaf?
I made RSO for 4 years straight and I fully mastered it, over the 4 years I have learned to half decarb it with heat then wait 2 to 6 weeks for it to finish naturally decarbing. I would have 5 years of making RSO under my belt, but when I sampled the naturally decarbed oil, I had no intentions of making RSO again, unless it was an emergency to treat someone. I 100% assure you no heat whatsoever, fully naturally decarbed, blows the doors off any other oil that was heated that I have tried. My patients would attest to that. Some of my patients have tried many different oils, considering they are cancer patients that have been around the block.
Thanks again!
Feb 21 2015
I am starting to look into other essential oils. I am a complete newbie in that area though, have much to learn. I know there are a lot of other plants out there that offer powerful medicinal properties like marijuana. I plan on doing more research and looking into more products. I am also interested on how they may effect an RSO buzz. For example: My ND Sap has the natural cannabis terpenes and it has a strong effect on the buzz and for some weird reason it makes the same potency buzz last twice as long. I wonder if there are other plant terpenes that can offer the same benefits when taken with RSO. Here is a link to frankincense http://articles.mercola.com/herbal-oils/frankincense-oil.aspx
Hopefully I will be adding more to this in the near future.
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